Very Special Episode: Hacks for Getting Regular Exercise
A listener asked for a Very Special Episode about exercise, because while she was an enthusiastic and regular exerciser, many of her favorite people weren’t.
First: Is exercise truly important if we want to live happier, healthier lives? Yes! Overwhelming research shows that people who exercise are healthier, more energetic, think more clearly, sleep better, and have delayed onset of dementia. They get relief from anxiety and mild depression. They perform better at work. Exercise is linked to happier moods overall.
Also, although it’s tempting to flop down on the couch when we’re feeling exhausted, exercise is actually a great way to boost energy levels. Feeling tired is a reason to exercise, not a reason to skip exercise.
In our discussion, we talk about our own personal hacks for getting regular exercise (we’re both natural couch potatoes) as well as dozens of hacks from listeners. Along the way, we mention…
- My bestselling book Better Than Before, which outlines the twenty-one strategies we can use to make or break our habits
- The Four Tendencies quiz that tells you whether you’re an Upholder, Questioner, Obliger, or Rebel
- For a helpful overview of how to use your Tendency to help change a habit, read here
- Want an article with more hacks for getting regular exercise?
- Try using the Don’t Break the Chain Habit Tracker journal
- Try using the Happier app
Resource
If you’re like to start an exercise routine but struggle to stay consistent, the Don’t Break the Chain Habit Tracker can help you build your habits and achieve your aims. “Don’t break the chain” is a powerful strategy for building daily habits, and this tracker makes it easier to maintain. Get yours at happiercast.com/journals.
What We’re Reading
*This transcript is unedited*
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[music]
Gretchen
Hello and welcome to happier, a podcast where we talk about strategies, hacks, tips, suggestions for how to build happier habits into our everyday lives. This week is a very special episode. Every 10th episode is a very special episode, and this is episode for 90 and we will be talking about exercise.
Gretchen
I’m Gretchen Rubin, writer who studies happiness, good habits, the five senses, human nature. I’m in my little home office in New York City. And joining me today from Los Angeles is my sister, Elizabeth Craft. Elizabeth, soon you and I will be exercising together. We will be on the trail together in beautiful England.
Elizabeth
That’s me. Elizabeth Craft, TV writer and producer living in L.A.. And yes, Gretch, I can’t wait. I have to tell you, I’ve made many purchases of things to wear based on listener suggestions. Yes. So I now have my toe liner socks, and I hope not to get blisters.
Gretchen
I’m gonna wait and hear your report on the toe liners. I couldn’t figure out what those were. The before we jump in, this very special episode is all hacks about creating habits of regular exercise. But I have a request for another kind of hack. As I’ve mentioned, my daughter Eleanor is going off to college in late August and I would like any suggestions for this time of life.
Gretchen
I went through with this with my older daughter Eliza, but that was so long ago I forgotten everything like we did this blues bag for her. We made her like a tote bag full of little gifts to open if she felt homesick, if she felt the blues. But I’d almost forgotten that I’d had that idea. So I need to refresh my recollection.
Gretchen
And then I’ll also get more suggestions from listeners. So send them.
Elizabeth
In. And Gretchen, are these hacks for Eleanor on her journey, or are they for you as a new open door parent?
Gretchen
They’re both. Okay. Well, okay. Any suggestions for the child, for the parent? Okay. For the grandparent, for the aunt, anything. It’s a major transition. So any suggestions? I would personally welcome them and we’ll put them together. But now let’s jump into the subject of today’s conversation, which is just a huge hack extravaganza about exercise. And we were inspired to do this episode from a listener.
Elizabeth
Yes, Kelsey said, I’d love to request a very special episode about exercise, and my specific interest is in how people started and have kept up exercise routines who previously did not exercise at all. I love to exercise and always have. Since I was 16 and started running with my dad, and it’s one of my favorite things. I love Orangetheory and hope you do too, Liz, but I have so many people in my life who say they want to exercise regularly, but can’t seem to start or keep going.
Elizabeth
I just turned 40 and so not exercising is starting to have serious health impacts on people. I care about. The things that work for me as a lifelong exerciser and upholder often don’t work for them. So I thought maybe hearing from all tendencies, and specifically from people who have gone couch to exercise could be helpful for me as I try to happiness, bully my friends, to health.
Gretchen
Great question, fantastic question. But I think the initial question is, does exercise really matter if we’re thinking about habits to form for happiness? Is this important? And I think it’s absolutely clear. I feel like it’s more clear with each passing year. As scientists study the human body more and exercise more, that exercise truly is an essential habit for happiness and good health, which of course, are tied together.
Gretchen
Yeah, active people have lower incidences of all sorts of health issues heart disease, obesity, dementia, exercise, improve circulation, posture, focus, creativity. Research shows that people who exercise are healthier, more energetic. They think more clearly, they sleep better. They have delayed onset of dementia. they have better immune function. They get relief from anxiety and mild depression. And exercise is linked to happier moods overall.
Gretchen
Yes.
Elizabeth
And if you’re feeling tired, that’s actually a reason to exercise. Yes. Not a reason to skip exercise if you make you less tired.
Gretchen
Yeah, no. Unless you’re like, really exercising at the Outer Limits, you’re doing a long run when you’re training for the marathon. For most people, exercise will boost energy, not deplete energy. So feeling sluggish is a reason to exercise, not a reason to skip exercising. And the energy itself is tied to happiness. Because when we have more energy, then we can do the things that we know that will make us happier.
Gretchen
But take effort, like planning a party or dealing with a nagging task, or clearing clutter, or calling a friend or volunteering. When we have physical energy, we’re more likely to do the things that then will make us happier.
Elizabeth
Yeah, and Gretchen, I know if I exercise in a day, I feel like it was a good day. No matter what else happened, I feel like I did that. I accomplished that this was a good, productive day.
Gretchen
Yeah, well, in my book, Better Than Before, I talk about the 21 strategies that we can use to make or break our habits. And one of the strategies is the strategy of foundation, because there are a few foundational habits that really affect our ability to form all other habits. And those foundational habits are sleeping, managing, eating and drinking.
Gretchen
Like not letting yourself get too hungry or thirsty for some people, but not everybody decluttering. Because for most people, outer order contributes to inner calm, but not for everyone. And then also exercise. You know, just taking care of your body and getting that exercise is something that really does pay off in terms of a happier, healthier, more productive, more creative life.
Elizabeth
Yes, but you have to get that exercise routine going, as Kelsey pointed out.
Gretchen
Just and that’s what we’re going to talk about. But one last thing just generally is there’s one thing that exercise really does not help with much, but people assume that it does, and that is with losing weight. The research is clear that if one of your aims is to lose weight, you’re much better off approaching that from the eating side, not the exercising side.
Gretchen
There’s a proverb exercise for sanity, not vanity, because it has all of these enormous good consequences. But that is one consequence that people think that it has, that it does not.
Elizabeth
Yes, although I will point out that you do look better when you exercise. So it also does help with vanity. Yeah. There’s no question that you look better and you get toned. Yes. And your skin, all of that. It’s just not for actually dropping the pattern. Right.
Gretchen
And it seems to help people maintain a weight. But yeah. Right. Absolutely. Yeah. There’s a bazillion reasons to exercise, which is why it really is important to try to do it. But it can be it can be a hard habit. And it’s one that you have to do consistently and regularly to get the benefit of it. So before we get into the specific hacks, I thought it might be helpful to talk about some of the major strategies that these exemplify.
Gretchen
So in Better Than Before, my book about habit change, I talk about the 21 strategies that we can use to make or break our habits. And there’s some that come up over and over as we hear a listener suggestion and we talk about our own suggestions. One is the tendency Kelsey mentions that she’s an upholder and we won’t go through all four tendencies.
Gretchen
But if you want to learn about the tendencies and learn your tendency, take the quiz. Gretchen rubin.com/quiz. It’s really important to know your tendency because this really comes up in the exercise habit. What works for the obliger is not going to work for a rebel, so you really want to take that into account. Another important strategy is the strategy of accountability.
Gretchen
That’s key for Obligers. It’s really important for a lot of people safeguards. This is when you’re doing if then planning like if I travel for work then I will do X for exercise or if there’s bad weather what will I do? Another is convenience and inconvenience. Like to hilarious degree. We’re very focused on whether things are convenient or inconvenient.
Gretchen
Another strategy is monitoring. For a lot of people, monitoring is really, really effective as a way to keep yourself exercising and then also pairing, which is when you pair exercise with another behavior that you really love to do or that you really have to do. So those two things always go together. There’s 21 strategies. They’re all useful for exercise, but those are some of the ones that I think are the most applicable to the habit of exercise.
Elizabeth
Well, Gretch, let’s talk about some of our exercise hacks. I think it’s safe to say we are both natural couch potatoes. We should easily not exercise the rest of our lives.
Gretchen
I think it’s a major life accomplishment that you and I both regularly exercise.
Elizabeth
I agree, I agree, and it always feels like it’s on the cusp of feeling away 1,000%. Be careful and safeguard it. As you said earlier, say constant vigilance.
Gretchen
Yes. And that’s a great example that just because you’ve done something for five years regularly does not mean that it couldn’t vanish overnight. I feel exactly the same way. It’s something to guard.
Elizabeth
So one thing that is.
Gretchen
Really.
Elizabeth
Worked for me in recent years, as I’ve discussed on the podcast, is setting goals. So last year I had my frame in 50. I wanted to do my frame in Canyon Hike 50 times in the year. I ended up upping it to 100. Yes, and accomplishing that. And then this year I just decided to do Orange Theory 50.
Elizabeth
So I decided I was going to do a new kind of exercise, Orange Theory class, because I wanted to get more cardio 50 times. I started late because I was sick at the beginning of the year, but I’m up to, I think, class 24.
Gretchen
Wow. That’s amazing.
Elizabeth
So I’m almost halfway there. So yes.
Gretchen
So you have the aim of exercising consistently, which is like the sort of endless aim. But the goal is this year I want to do frame 100. Yes.
Elizabeth
And it makes a huge difference to me if I’m taking it off or if I’m worried will. If I skip this week, then I won’t hit that number and I’ll have an extra session. I’ll have to do so. It really helps me with just kind of the monitoring of it. Yeah. Another huge thing for me is to use that time as socializing.
Elizabeth
So a big reason I really like hiking is because I can talk to a friend while doing it, and that really motivates me to get out of bed at 630 in the morning, in the middle of the summer to beat the heat, and actually show up and talk to somebody. Right.
Gretchen
And I would say that’s separate from the accountability of meeting somebody who’s counting on you, but it makes it so much more fun for you that encourages you to keep up with it. Absolutely. To do more than the minimum.
Elizabeth
Yeah, yeah, it’s my favorite way to talk to friends is walking. And then the other thing for me Gretchen and you talk about this all the time putting it on the schedule. Yeah. For me it’s like if I sign up for a class three days in advance then in my mind I know. Okay. Thursday at 510 I am going to be at Orange Theory.
Elizabeth
Right. And that really helps me. And also for planning things with friends, hikes with friends. If I go, okay, Saturday morning I’m meeting this person that I know I’ll do it if I’m just on my own and I wake up randomly on Saturday morning, chances of me just spontaneously getting out of bed and going to Fryman Canyon are much smaller.
Elizabeth
Yeah. Then if it’s on the schedule.
Gretchen
For me, some things that have been hatched in recent years is I realized that I really was not enjoying going to the gym, and it was hard for me to give up my gym membership even though I wasn’t going because it was part of my identity. Like I belong to a gym and I go to the gym. But it was so rackety I realized like it was just such an unpleasant experience and what I really wanted to do was walk in Central Park, which was beautiful.
Gretchen
So I’ve been doing that. But Elizabeth, you’ve inspired me to realize I should do more cardio. And so I’m, I’m maybe it’s part of my open door. I’m going to start going to Orange Theory, like, you know, or doing something else because I realize I have a lot of movement and other kinds of exercise, but I don’t do cardio these days.
Elizabeth
Okay, well, I think this is something we can talk a lot about on our, walkabouts and.
Gretchen
Oh, okay. What can get me fired up?
Elizabeth
Do you want to do. Yes.
Gretchen
One of the things that was a huge revelation to me and maybe other people will identify with this is I realized I don’t like games. And so I had this association with myself. Like, I don’t like exercise because I don’t like games and I’m very physically awkward. So I was really bad at things like tennis or field hockey or whatever, or basketball, whatever it was.
Gretchen
But I just don’t even like games, period. And so realizing I could exercise and not have to be part of a game was a huge epiphany for me. Way back, because I’m fine exercising, but I don’t want to play a game.
Elizabeth
We are not going to join the pickleball movement.
Gretchen
Even if you have played pickleball one once, and I applaud you from the sidelines, I will not be picking up that pickleball paddle. And Elizabeth, I think there’s some things that have worked really well for both of us and one of them, and this goes to the like, lack of a game aspect of it is you and I both do high intensity weight training.
Gretchen
Yes. And we really embrace that because first of all, it’s extremely efficient use of time. And it’s really a good way to like workout your whole body at a really, really high level. But you know, it doesn’t last that long. And so it’s sort of for somebody who doesn’t maybe enjoy the process that much. It’s a really good way to get a great workout.
Elizabeth
Yes. And also you don’t sweat a lot. So if you need to do something and then go directly to work, yes, it’s a great thing because you can just take half an hour and be done and then not have to shower.
Gretchen
Yeah, but it’s funny because I was talking to some guy about it and he was said to me very dismissively like, look, it can’t be real exercise if you don’t need to take a shower afterwards. And I’m like, did you go do it? And you tell me if you’ve had a big workout because I am not sweating, but my muscles are shaking.
Elizabeth
I’ve been working hard. Yeah, sometimes. I mean, it’s hard to lift a coffee cup afterwards, and sometimes I workout so hard that I actually start almost falling asleep. I’ve had that in the middle of it because I suddenly I just like, I must nap now.
Gretchen
But then it’s over. So yes. So we’re big fans of high intensity weight training and then also getting a dog. So research shows that people who have dogs walk far more often than people without dogs, and children who live in households with dogs are substantially more active than children in homes without dogs. I don’t know that either one of us really thought about that when we got our dogs, but it turns out that’s a really good thing to do for general exercise related health.
Elizabeth
Yes, I know I walk a lot more now that I have Nacho and Daisy for sure. Okay, Gretch, coming up, we’ll hear exercise hacks from listeners. But first, the spring.
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Gretchen
The first hack comes from Jen, she said, I give myself some grace. If I don’t really feel like doing anything, I tell myself it’s okay to just go for a walk. Just knowing I can step back makes it easier to get the planned workout in the list. That this reminds me, our father used to always say it counts as a run if the door shuts behind you, so it’s like you get credit just the minute you’re out there with your running shoes on.
Gretchen
Yep.
Elizabeth
Elizabeth said when I decided to practice yoga every day, I didn’t set a time minimum like at least ten minutes a day. Some days get away from me and I jump out of bed to do a two minute sun salutation before going to sleep, but that way I can still keep the streak going. Using a tracking app to keep myself accountable to the daily part of the habit helps keep me motivated.
Elizabeth
I’m on day 1047 and counting. Wow. Oh, way to go.
Gretchen
Way to go! Tish says. As a rebel, I often remind myself to stay mobile and flexible so I can keep having fun as I get older. So again, this is the rebel tendency going into identity, going into freedom and choice, really tapping into those values as a rebel, Jacqui said.
Elizabeth
I check in with a group of women on the app, Marco Polo, and send a video after exercise. Also, I use the don’t break the chain habit tracker. I track ten minute abs and yoga. Any movement counts.
Gretchen
Right? In the happier app we have. The don’t break the chain is one of the most popular tools because people love don’t break the chain, Alison says. I set low expectations and as I got better at running consistently, got myself cuter. Workout clothes. This is interesting, and I want to say because better than before. I write about the strategy of reward.
Gretchen
The strategy of reward is a very complicated and often counterproductive strategy, because rewards can sometimes undermine habits, strangely. But the reward that is good is a reward that takes you deeper into the habit. And so what is the reward for running cuter? Running close. Yeah. And so that’s a good use of reward.
Elizabeth
Kristen said. I walk my age miles during my birthday months. This year I’m turning 54 and will walk 54 miles. That’s such a fun idea.
Gretchen
That’s fun, that’s fun, Laura says. Peloton bike. The fact that others can see if I’ve worked out is a motivator for this. Obliger excellent, great way to tap into that accountability.
Elizabeth
Adventure, mom says. I only watch ridiculous reality shows when I workout. The cheesier or cringe or the better. Well, that’s the pairing, Gretchen, that you were mentioning earlier, right?
Gretchen
You can watch that show only when you’re working out, Courtney says. I’ve been a consistent morning exerciser for ten years. Through new jobs, marriage, and births of three kids. Find the type of exercise you love and make it non-negotiable. To do it every morning, schedule it and make sure your partner can support you. For instance, will watch the kids.
Gretchen
It will become a habit and before long you will just do it without thinking morning as best. So you weren’t thinking about it, dreading it, pushing it back all day. Okay, so a few things I would say. First of all, she’s clearly a morning person. And so I think if you’re a morning person this is great advice. Mornings are more predictable.
Gretchen
If you’re a night person, you might want to think about that, making sure that you work with a partner so that you get coverage for your exercise is great. I think sometimes people are reluctant to say to somebody else, you know, we need to set it up so that I can exercise regularly, but it really is a high priority.
Gretchen
And so it’s worth having that conversation and working that out, Chris said.
Elizabeth
Close ring, my rings on my Apple Watch, became my accountability partner. I hear you Chris. I am looking at those rings all day long.
Gretchen
And Louise says I’m a rebel and I have a complicated relationship with taking care of myself. I begin walking again with the simple thought, I want to be the person who walks four miles a day. I actually want to be the person who walks ten miles. But I’m also the person who knows that I first have to be the person who walks four miles a day.
Gretchen
So again, this is a rebel tapping into an identity. I am the kind of person who walks every day, and so the habit follows from the identity.
Elizabeth
Shauna has said. A few years ago, while stuck in an office job, I set myself a challenge to exercise every day for a year. My rules were simple. It had to be something above and beyond what I would have done in the normal course of the day, so it could be a gym class or a run, but also it could be a lunchtime walk or an online yoga class.
Elizabeth
I achieved it and it completely changed my mindset about exercise. Now I need it. I’ve changed my job to one where I can be active and on my feet all day, and hiking is my favorite way to spend a day off. So now I climb stairs instead of taking the lift. Walk everywhere I can rather than drive. There are opportunities to move all around us if we look for them.
Gretchen
Well, this is a great idea and I would say for people who aren’t exercising now, it’s good to remember that it builds on itself. And as you exercise, you do feel restless. You do feel like you want to exercise more. It does build on itself in that way. Jennifer said. The best exercise is the one you’ll do. I find a mini trampoline to be quick and simple 15 minutes first thing in the morning.
Gretchen
Just do it. Well, you know, I didn’t know that. It turns out that the trampoline is really good exercise. I’ll post a link to an article that I read about it. Alissa I thought of Jack because Jack loves jumping on a trampoline. Yes, this is something I hadn’t thought about, Lynn.
Elizabeth
Says as an obliger for several years, my workout partner picked me up at 5 a.m. each morning. I went to bed each night and clean workout clothes. I roll out of bed, grab my water bottle and tie my shoes in the car. She had young children and had to be home so her husband can get a workout before work, and I needed an accountability partner.
Elizabeth
Win win.
Gretchen
I have heard from a surprising number of people who sleep in their workout clothes.
Elizabeth
Yes, my friends who rowed crew in college would sleep in their workout clothes so that they would just have to put on their shoes. Exact same thing.
Gretchen
There you go, Alicia said. I became the instructor. Now I have no choice but to be there six times a week. When it comes to my own personal workouts. I do best when I schedule something with someone else, either in person or virtually. I’ve heard from many obligers who become the instructor because that is the ultimate accountability. It’s no one can exercise unless you show up, Raine says.
Elizabeth
As a questioner, I need a Y, which I articulate to myself as being able to put my own luggage into the overhead compartment speaks to having the health to be able to travel independently and do many other things for decades to come.
Gretchen
So this is good because as a questioner, it really is the why? Why am I doing this? And also what’s the most efficient way can I customize this to myself? But this is really tapping into the reasons that you’re doing it to keep you going.
Elizabeth
All right, Gretch, coming up, we have more great exercise hacks from listeners. But first, this break.
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Elizabeth
Okay, Gretch, we are back with more hacks. about exercise, Betsy says I listened to your podcast while I walk. Feels like you’re my companion. my friend Mindy does this while she walks her dog. Oh, that’s texting me. I’m listening to your podcast.
Gretchen
I love that we’re pairing for people. That’s great. Yeah. Sarah said I used a few of your tricks. Don’t Break the Chain was one of them. And for several months I stuck to 30 minutes of movement every morning. It doesn’t have to be heavy gym, swim, yoga, run or just walk. But it happen. Yep. Don’t break the chain works for a lot of people.
Gretchen
I have a don’t break the chain journal too. If you like to have a journal, I’ll post a link to that. Or you can do it in the happier app. Or there’s a lot of ways to do don’t break the chain because it’s so effective. But I feel like a journal. It’s kind of a fun keepsake to have.
Elizabeth
Yes, I love mine, Caitlin said. If you engage in different kinds of workouts, create different bags with the supplies you need for each one, even if this means having multiples like leggings. I also enjoy orange Theory and have a duffle with my heart rate monitor, charger, a backup water bottle, and the shoes I wear for Orange Theory separately.
Elizabeth
My running duffle has running shoes, socks, and so on. Although this creates a little added expense, I find that not transferring supplies between activity bags ensures I never show up for a workout without something I need. I also find that my supplies don’t go missing when they’re always in the bag for their activity. Great idea!
Gretchen
Well, this is the strategy of convenience and the strategy of inconvenience, which is if there’s something you want to encourage yourself to do, make it as convenient as possible. And so that’s a great suggestion, Connie said. I once took an exercise class where before class, you wrote down three words on how you were feeling, and immediately after the workout, again, you wrote three words to describe how you were feeling.
Gretchen
It became so clear to me how much exercise helped me to feel more energized, focused, and motivated. This has helped me to stay consistent with working out, and now it is part of my weekly routine. For this hack, I want to give credit to Antoinette Hemphill, who started Momma B’s, a fitness and media brand. That’s a great idea because that really gets you focused on the why and also the benefits.
Gretchen
And so that’s going to help you keep going.
Elizabeth
Yeah. And it really is a mood booster, as we were talking about at the beginning of the podcast, nothing can improve my mood more than finishing an exercise class or a hike.
Gretchen
Well, this is so many great hacks from listeners. Also, I wrote a piece a while back with more hacks about how to exercise regularly. So if you want even more hacks, I will post a link to that in the show notes. And I will just say that the book better Than before, which goes into all the 21 strategies.
Gretchen
So if you want to read more about a particular strategy that appeals to you so you can think about how you might apply it to exercise better than before, it’s a great resource for that. But let us know if you do try these hacks at home in which exercise hacks work for you or their ones we miss. This is such an important yes habit.
Gretchen
We want every hack we can get. Let us know on Instagram threads. Tick tock. Facebook. Drop us an email and podcast at Gretchen rubin.com. As always, you can go to the show notes. This is a very special episode of 10th episode. It’s how Broadcast.com for 90 for everything related to this episode.
Elizabeth
And what’s the resource for this week?
Gretchen
Reg well, I just want to mention again, I mentioned it before, but if you are struggling to stay consistent with exercising, don’t Break the chain is something that works for all the tendencies and people tend to find very satisfying, as many listeners had hacks related to that. So my don’t break the chain habit tracker really could help you build that habit.
Gretchen
If you go to have your Cars.com slash journals, you can check out the Don’t Break the Chain Habit tracker.
Elizabeth
I love mine, yeah.
Gretchen
And it’s what are we reading? What are you. Well, that’s another habit we like to do consistently. What are you.
Elizabeth
Reading? I am reading The Shepherd’s Life by James Banks.
Gretchen
And I’m reading The Comforters by Muriel Spark, and that’s it for this episode of happier. Remember to try this at home. Try some of these exercise hacks. Let us know what you tried and if it worked for you.
Elizabeth
Thank you to our Executive producer, Chuck Reed and everyone at Audacy. Get in touch Gretchen’s on Instagram threads, Facebook and TikTok at Gretchen Rubin and I’m on Instagram and threads at Liz Craft. And if you like the show.
Gretchen
You know what I’m going to say? Please be sure to tell a friend and follow us wherever you get your podcasts. And here is your rhyme. If you like our vibe, please subscribe.
Elizabeth
Until next week I’m Elizabeth.
Gretchen
Craft and I’m Gretchen Rubin. Thanks for joining us. Onward and upward.
Gretchen
Yeah. Elizabeth, you’ve gotten me intrigued with Orange Theory. I had never heard of it until you mentioned it. And of course, now I see it everywhere. And I’m really thinking that I need to have cardio. You’re way ahead of me on the cardio front.
Elizabeth
Yeah. Gretch, I don’t know how you feel about Orange Theory. You should try it and see. Okay. I’m curious. You might love it. You might not. I really. I’m getting so much out of it.
Gretchen
Well, you’ve done it a lot.
Gretchen
From the onward project.