Update
A listener mentions the Five-Senses Journal.
Try This at Home
Avoid avoidance.
We mention the Four Tendencies personality framework. If you don’t know whether you’re an Upholder, Questioner, Obliger, or Rebel, you can take the quick, free quiz here.
We also mention the value of giving ourselves healthy treats.
Happiness Hack
To cut meat, vegetables, and more, a listener suggests using scissors instead of a knife and fork; it’s much faster.
Four Tendencies Tip
The business world distinguishes between “planned downtime” and “unplanned downtime,” and “planned maintenance” and “unplanned maintenance.”
In our own lives, if we don’t plan for maintenance, our systems may fail in ways that are disruptive, expensive, more work—or they may even become emergencies.
Even if you agree that planned maintenance or downtime is better than unplanned, you may still struggle to make time for it. It can feel disruptive, non-productive—it’s often easier to keep charging forward.
Tapping into your Tendency may help you take that time.
Treat yourself like a factory!
Listener Answers
In episode 478, we suggested reading a book that sheds a light on how things work, as a way to make life more interesting.
We got so many great suggestions!
Books:
- The Evolution of Useful Things: How Everyday Artifacts—From Forks and Pins to Paper Clips and Zippers-Came to Be as They Are by Henry Petroski (Amazon, Bookshop)
- Upstairs at the White House: My Life with the First Ladies by J. B. West (Amazon, Bookshop)
- The Kingdom of Prep: The Inside Story of the Rise and (Near) Fall of J.Crew by Maggie Bullock (Amazon, Bookshop)
- Nine Pints: A Journey Through the Money, Medicine, and Mysteries of Blood by Rose George (Amazon, Bookshop)
- The Big Necessity: The Unmentionable World of Human Waste and Why It Matters by Rose George (Amazon, Bookshop)
- Gut: The Inside Story of Our Body’s Most Underrated Organ by Giulia Enders (Amazon, Bookshop)
- The Song Machine: Inside the Hit Factory by John Seabrook (Amazon, Bookshop)
- Dog Is Love: Why and How Your Dog Loves You by Clive Wynne (Amazon, Bookshop)
- If Chins Could Kill: Confessions of a B Movie Actor by Bruce Campbell (Amazon, Bookshop)
- How Buildings Learn: What Happens After They’re Built by Stewart Brand (Amazon, Bookshop)
- The Library Book by Susan Orlean (Amazon, Bookshop)
- Gulp: Adventures on the Alimentary Canal by Mary Roach (Amazon, Bookshop)
- Bonk: The Curious Coupling of Science and Sex by Mary Roach (Amazon, Bookshop)
- Stiff: The Curious Lives of Human Cadavers by Mary Roach (Amazon, Bookshop)
- The Way Things Work by David Macaulay (Amazon, Bookshop)
- Meet Me by the Fountain: An Inside History of the Mall by Alexandra Lange (Amazon, Bookshop)
- Paved Paradise: How Parking Explains the World by Henry Grabar (Amazon, Bookshop)
- At Home: A Short History of Private Life by Bill Bryson (Amazon, Bookshop)
- The Body: A Guide for Occupants by Bill Bryson (Amazon, Bookshop)
- An Immense World: How Animal Senses Reveal the Hidden Realms Around Us by Ed Yong (Amazon, Bookshop)
- Kitchen Confidential: Adventures in the Culinary Underbelly by Anthony Bourdain (Amazon, Bookshop)
- Unraveled: The Life and Death of a Garment by Maxine Bedat (Amazon, Bookshop)
- How Things Work by several authors (Amazon, Bookshop)
- Hotbox: Inside Catering, the Food World’s Riskiest Business by Matt Lee (Amazon, Bookshop)
- The Residence: Inside the Private World of the White House by Kate Andersen Brower (Amazon, Bookshop)
Podcasts:
- 99% Invisible with Roman Mars
- The Economics of Everyday Things
- Mailin’ It
Demerits & Gold Stars
Gretchen’s Demerit: I’ve been very indecisive lately.
Elizabeth’s Gold Star: She gives a gold star to her doctors, who are so attentive.
Resource
If you want to learn more about your own complement of senses—including which of the five senses you neglect most—you can take my free, short quiz, “What’s Your Neglected Sense?“
What We’re Reading
**This transcript is unedited**
481
[music]
Elizabeth
Hello and welcome to happier a podcast where we talk about cutting edge science, the wisdom of the ages, lessons from pop culture and our own experiences about how to be happier. This week we’ll talk about why it’s a good idea to avoid avoidance and why plan maintenance works better than unplanned maintenance. Plus, we’ll have a lot of suggestions of books about how the world works and I’m Gretchen Rubin, a writer who studies happiness, good Habits, The Five Senses and Human Nature.
Elizabeth
I’m in my little home office in New York City, and joining me today from L.A. is my sister, Elizabeth Craft. And Elizabeth, we often discuss how we’re trying to avoid avoidance.
Gretchen
That’s me, Elizabeth Craft, a TV writer and producer living in L.A.. And yes, Gretch, I have been known to avoid death in my life.
Elizabeth
We’ve all done it. Before we jump in a few updates.
Gretchen
Gretch, this comes from Elizabeth. She says, As part of my writing, 2 to 4 minutes and 2024, I started the Five Senses Journal and have also kept up my one sentence journal. I think Gretchen is using the same two inspirations.
Elizabeth
Yeah, that’s.
Gretchen
True. The Five Senses Journal has been a new way of journaling for me and I find myself noting sensory experiences throughout the day to pull onto the pages of my journal. It has added a finer focus to how I perceive daily life, and it’s been delightful to walk through the world this way. We recently went on spring break with our son to Paris and Amsterdam, and I took my Five Senses journal with me.
Gretchen
It was a great way to document our travels. Now, when I go back and read my entries from that trip, the memories are incredible, clear and palpable. It’s just a deeper level of memory. Things like the texture of the train seats on the train from Paris to Amsterdam or the surface of the canal boat we took through Amsterdam.
Gretchen
Or the taste of the surprise bottle of champagne in our final dinner in Paris. Take me right back to those moments, perhaps because the memories are embodied, they are stronger and deeper. I will journal this way on every trip I have from here on out.
Elizabeth
Well, I loved hearing this because this is exactly how it works for me and exactly how I hope other people would use it, because there’s things that you don’t. At least for me, that I don’t notice unless I’m trying to notice them. Like I love the thing about the texture of train seats. Yes. Because that’s the kind of thing that later is such a fun memory to have, but it’s hard to notice it in the moment.
Elizabeth
At least it is for me.
Gretchen
Yeah. And it brings back so much. I think that’s what’s called like just that one detail then brings all these other details. But I mean, this was sort of why you wrote the entire book. It is, Yeah. So it’s all encompassed in this.
Elizabeth
Yes. So that was very exciting. And if anybody wants to check it out, you can grab your cars.com slash shop and take a look and see. It’s interesting because I thought of it like a journal, but maybe you would use it as a travel journal and not do it in your everyday, but just when you’re traveling or. Yeah.
Elizabeth
Anyway, people are so creative in how they think of using tools beyond what’s suggested. It’s always fascinating to me. And one more thing to mention is that we’re going to do an Ask US Anything episode coming up, and so send in your questions. It can be about happiness. The Five Senses, Human Nature, Hollywood Careers, Kansas City. Yes. How is it that I got along as kids?
Elizabeth
What You should order it wins. Does anything send in any question you have and we will put those together. We haven’t done one of those in a while. Is it? And they are so fine.
Gretchen
Yes. Send your questions.
Elizabeth
So now for the try this at home for this week. And our suggestion is to avoid avoidance. Research shows that anxiety comes up for us in many ways, and one of the ways it shows up is avoidance.
Gretchen
And so what exactly is avoidance?
Elizabeth
Okay, so avoidance is just what it sounds like. It’s a coping strategy where we make efforts with our thoughts or feelings or actions to deny, minimize or postpone dealing with something that is a stressful demand or a painful emotion. We avoid those stressors rather than deal with them because we don’t want to deal with them.
Gretchen
Right. And the idea is it can feel easier to avoid a situation that makes you feel sad or worried or fearful. But in the end, it often makes things worse. Yes, it is not helping you deal with whatever is stressing you out. I think we’ve all experienced this many, many times. Yes.
Elizabeth
Because it comes up all the time. Now, before we get into this conversation, of course, if a person’s challenge with this issue is really hurting their life, if it’s really a problem, it’s time to get professional help and really get into it. But this, like you say, this is something that most of us do more than we find useful in our everyday life.
Elizabeth
So this is sort of when it’s an ordinary problem. So if it’s becoming an exceptional problem, get help. This is for the ordinary person, because the fact is avoidance is not a good coping strategy. Often things they either don’t get better, but they often get worse so that by avoiding it, you’re actually making a problem more stressful, more difficult, more challenging because you’re not dealing with it.
Gretchen
As you always say, Gretch. The stewing is worse than the doing.
Elizabeth
Yes, I love I love that proverb. Yes. Love the fluency heuristic where things rhyme and we’ve talked about this. It’s come up in a lot of situations for us, Elizabeth. I mean, one of the ways you and I really suffer from avoidance is airline tickets and travel. Generally, both of us do not. Some people love it. I so envy the people who love to get on there and look at options and think about it.
Elizabeth
I feel like whatever I pick, I’m going to make the wrong decision and get stuck in an airport for 6 hours. So I try to avoid that or like choosing dates and it just gets worse. You have fewer options and the prices rise.
Gretchen
Yes. I mean, it can make a difference in thousands of dollars.
Elizabeth
Yes, it.
Gretchen
Can is finally gotten me, I think, to try to get my tickets in a time when.
Elizabeth
You know, you really led the way on this list that I have to say, because last couple of years you’ve been like, I got my tickets to Kansas City for Christmas and it’s like September off thinking, okay, she’s done it. I guess the clock is ticking. But yeah, it’s we’ve learned it the hard.
Gretchen
Way and then a big one. Gretchen And this can have major consequences is health issues.
Elizabeth
Yes.
Gretchen
So many of us have some concern and we don’t want to go to the doctor, but of course, that’s the absolute wrong thing to do.
Elizabeth
Avoiding a health issue. And then there are things that are like planning a child summer where it’s going to be complicated and many, many stages and lots of probably discussions. And it just feels so complicated and you think, gosh, I’ll just do it tomorrow. But again, it often gets harder because maybe you don’t get the program. That was the first choice or you don’t get the dates you want or other kinds of decisions can’t be made because it’s sort of a chicken and the egg.
Elizabeth
So is this like deal with it as soon as you can is often better? Yes.
Gretchen
And then another thing that many of us avoid is having a hard conversation. yeah. So whether that be with a coworker, a friend, a kid, a parent, again, that’s a conversation that is likely not going to get easier. It may get harder, but it definitely won’t get easier and it’s going to weigh you down. And yes, that’s the kind of thing that can keep you up at night.
Elizabeth
Yes, absolutely. And I think that’s a huge one. And then I think the final one is not wanting to check your bank account, not wanting to look at your bills and just like having a pile and just not thinking about it. And again, things can get worse because you’re just avoiding it. And so the stress will rise and rise because your situation is getting worse so that when you do, when you are forced to deal with it, it can get much worse.
Elizabeth
I mean, kind of the thing in my family, which stands for the idea of avoidance kind of in our family law is when Eliza was in, I think, sixth grade, they had this thing called the electricity Project. And then by the time Eleanor came along, they had really refined this project, so it was much less stressful. But poor Eliza was in the when the school was just introducing it and they hadn’t worked out all the kinks.
Elizabeth
It required all this stuff and she avoided it and avoided it and we didn’t even know about it. And then one day it was like, I have to have this project done by Monday. And I looked at the assignment sheet and it’s like, these were not you didn’t have to go buy batteries from a drugstore. These were like complicated electricity items that we had to like go to a special store to get.
Elizabeth
So of course, I was like flustered by this and she didn’t have any time. And then she didn’t have any time to talk to her teacher before it was due and to go back and forth. And so the whole thing was just sort of nightmarish. And she had a really bad result, frankly. And so now it’s always like this feels like the electricity protected me and everything’s like, yeah, we remember the electricity project.
Gretchen
Scratch brings to mind of my leaf collection project, just fourth grade, which was similarly horrendous for everyone involved, especially mom and Dad.
Elizabeth
That well, again, we decide now maybe one of the things we should say is one of my favorite proverbs of the professions, but like a traditional proverb is a stumble may prevent a fall. And this often comes up with parenting, which is like a small mistake in sixth grade, might prevent you from making a major fall in 11th grade.
Elizabeth
And so sometimes, maybe as a parent, we have to say like, I’m kind of thinking that the leave collection is not getting dealt with. You want to let them experience why avoidance isn’t a good coping strategy. That’s okay. But what do we do if we find that we’re avoiding? Okay, like, what are the steps that we can take if we’re like, okay, this is happening, you know, or This is something that I’m prone to, What do I do to avoid avoidance?
Gretchen
So first step is to identify the problem, realize that you’re avoiding something. Yes, identify the task you’re avoiding.
Elizabeth
This is easier said than done, right.
Gretchen
Because sometimes you think, it’s not the right time to get a plane ticket. It’s not that I’m avoiding. Yes, but it’s not the right time yet because I need all this information.
Elizabeth
Or with things that are really, really stressful and difficult. You don’t even allow them to come into your mind, you know, you just avoiding it so much that it’s just like a little flicker in your awareness. So I think part of it is really to try to allow yourself to experience that there is something that you want to avoid, and then it could be helpful to decide like, well, why are you avoiding, you know, identify the reasons?
Elizabeth
Because we talk about if you identify the problem, that can often help you spot solutions or make things easier. And Elizabeth, for this, I think about you wanting to avoid the social situations and saying, well, it’s not the social illness that I’m wanting to avoid, it’s the driving part of it. And so once you identify the problem and the reason that you’re avoiding a test, you might spot a solution that is not what you think it is.
Elizabeth
And then you might also say, well, do I have a fear that I have an acknowledged or a negative belief about myself? So maybe like you’re avoiding writing a wedding toast, but then when you really think about it, you’re like, Well, I have this identity of myself as, I’m terrible at public speaking. And so it’s like, okay, we’ll grapple with that.
Elizabeth
Are you terrible at public speaking? Like that’s an issue to be dealt with, which if you’re just avoiding the whole thing, you might not realize that is at the core of the issue.
Gretchen
Also, you want to start small and keep it manageable. So put it on the to do list for tomorrow. Then start with the least scary task. Was finding a phone number? Yes. Or starting a document and filling in the easy parts? Yes. This is something that I do a lot.
Elizabeth
Looking up a phone number counts as step one 100%, you know, and then once you start and you want to keep up the momentum, so do one thing and then say, okay, then I’m going to do another thing. I’m going to do another thing. Maybe it’s one thing every day. I mean, as long as you’re moving forward, you’re making progress and that is better than avoiding.
Elizabeth
So take it very small steps if you need to. But if you’ve got that momentum going, keep it up.
Gretchen
And then, of course, Gretch. We always talk about scheduling. If it’s on the schedule for both of us, yes, then it is much more likely. Yes.
Elizabeth
Yeah. This is a good thing to think about your tendency because we won’t get into all the four tendencies. But if you don’t know your tendency, you can take the quiz and learn about it. At gretchen, rubicam slash quiz. But if you know that you’re in a blazer move, you have an accountability partner for the thing that you’re to make sure that you engage with whatever you’re trying to do.
Elizabeth
And if you were a rebel, you might challenge yourself. Like, I think that I’m terrible at public speaking, but I’m going to give a great wedding toast. But for me, if it’s something that I’m avoiding, I literally will put it on my calendar, call the dentist to schedule an appointment. And for a questioner, it might be thinking about the efficiencies that you’ll lose, the money, that you’ll lose the time you lose, you know, the reasons why it makes sense to do it now rather than later.
Gretchen
And then you also want to think about your future self and the downsides of delaying how ultimately you’re giving yourself more anxiety, higher stakes, more expenses. A problem can grow and become an emergency. I mean, that’s true with like getting your passport renewed again with going to the doctor. Yeah, it can really blow up in your face.
Elizabeth
And here are two things that can make it easier. First, ask for help. I don’t know why this is so hard, but a lot of times I avoid something cause I’m sort of paralyzed because I don’t know what to do, but because I’m avoiding it, I don’t think like, Well, is there somebody that I could ask for help?
Elizabeth
Is there somebody who would have advice or would help me get started? Because I really just don’t know what to do, so ask for help? And then the other thing is give yourself healthy treats. Take steps to help yourself feel energized and cared for. If you’re dealing with something that is really difficult and stressing you out, give yourself that gold star for moving forward.
Elizabeth
Load yourself with healthy treats to recognize this is really difficult and painful. I do not want to do it, but I am going to do it and so I’m going to try to help myself.
Gretchen
Gretchen You really want to examine your avoidance because it can be important information. Negative emotion can be useful. So are you avoiding buying a plane ticket because it’s a pain or because you really don’t want to go in a rigid at way? Yes.
Elizabeth
So you want to use it as a helpful signal. But here’s the thing, Elizabeth. Sometimes when we avoid something, it’s because we’re hoping that in the end, whatever we’re avoiding won’t be necessary or it’ll be overtaken by events or somebody else will deal with it or something.
Gretchen
And the thing is such that happens just often enough to keep it as a tantalizing option. Sometimes things go away.
Elizabeth
Yes, I know, but not often.
Gretchen
Yes, not often, but it does happen.
Elizabeth
Yeah, well, anyway, avoid avoidance for the most part. Let us know if you do try this at home. How avoiding avoidance works for you. Have you found any great strategies or resources for dealing with it? Something that comes up a lot in everyday life? Let us know on Instagram threads Tock Facebook drop us an email at podcaster Gretchen Rubin dot com Or as always, you can go to the show notes.
Elizabeth
Go to have your cars.com slash 481 for everything related to this.
Gretchen
Episode coming up we have a very practical happiness hack. But first this break.
[music]
Elizabeth
Now it’s time for happiness hack and Elizabeth I love this hack. It is so simple and so applicable to so many things.
Gretchen
Yes. Gretchen it comes from miranda who says parenting hack. I am a mother of two girls, a two and a four year old and work full time as a nurse. So time is of the essence. One hack that helps me serve their meals faster is to use scissors instead of using a fork and knife to cut up their chicken, steak, broccoli to remove the stem, etc. into small pieces.
Gretchen
I use kitchen scissors and have found that I complete the task so much faster. It brought me so much joy when I came up with it. Wanted to share with listeners.
Elizabeth
Okay. This is something you don’t have to use just with children. I use it myself and it’s so much faster.
Gretchen
Yeah, and I love it. A nurse suggested this great, and it feels like something a nurse would figure out this very practical thing.
Elizabeth
What about, like, using a tool? Yes, yes, yes, absolutely. So that’s a great one.
Gretchen
Wonderful. Thank you, Miranda.
Elizabeth
And now for a four tendencies tip. And this comes from an idea in the business world. Okay, So one thing that they talk about is planned downtime versus unplanned downtime or planned maintenance versus unplanned maintenance. And so there’s a difference between what is the cost to your factory if you have plan downtime versus unplanned downtime, because you could have a plant that runs on what’s called run to fail maintenance plan, which is they just run it and run it and they only repair it is something that’s broken.
Elizabeth
But what the research shows, and I think that we all would suspect that this would be true, is that usually you’re better off staying ahead of that and like planning your downtime, planning your maintenance, and not just waiting for something to break or stop working.
Gretchen
Yes, this can apply to many areas of our lives. As we were just discussing earlier. Something becomes an emergency, then it can cost a lot more. It can be a huge inconvenience. It can mess up your schedule. Yeah. One area where this applies for me is with my car. yeah. So you don’t have to deal with cars that often.
Gretchen
But now I drive here in L.A. all the time and you need to do maintenance on your car. And if you don’t, eventually something bad will happen and it will no doubt happen at the worst possible. Yes. Yeah. Costs the most. Yes. Money. Now, in this conversation that we’re having at the moment, I must confess that my car is currently 85 days past due for service.
Gretchen
Every time I turn it on, it informs me that another day has passed. So this is going to inspire me for plan maintenance so I don’t end up on the side of the highway with the unplanned maintenance.
Elizabeth
Because that’s the thing is inevitably it ends up at the worst possible time. So planning for downtime can make life smoother overall. Now it’s tempting to always postpone it because you’re like, Whoa, I don’t need to do it. But if you can do it when you’re planning a break or know time, what you need for your own maintenance, your own downtime that can make your life smoother overall.
Elizabeth
And the reason that this is a four tendances tip, which is that if you kind of agree intellectually with the idea that the planned maintenance would be a better approach, but you may still struggle to do it because it does feel disruptive and nonproductive because you’re like, you know, I can’t drive while my car’s in the shop or whatever.
Elizabeth
It’s just easier to sort of keep charging forward and not making space for that. But by thinking about your tendency, you can figure out ways to make that time for plan maintenance. And you know, a lot of this might just be like relaxing for yourself, like taking a vacation, right? You need that for your plan maintenance. But for some people, it’s hard to say, okay, I’m going to take a week off from work.
Elizabeth
They just keep working and working and working. So how do you get yourself to take the planned maintenance? That’s where your tendency can come into play.
Gretchen
So what are the ways, the different tendencies should think about it?
Elizabeth
Okay, so for obligers, you might be helpful for you to think about it in terms of meeting the expectations of others. Like if I let myself get burned out, if I get myself, I let myself get exhausted and drained so that I get sick, then I’m not going to be able to keep up with my responsibilities. People are depending on me.
Elizabeth
I’m going to let people down. I might not be able to show up at an important occasion because I throw out my back again because I haven’t been doing my physical therapy, because I haven’t been taking the time from, you know, my busy schedule. So think about that outer accountability and work questionnaires that might be much more like, well, it’s more efficient.
Elizabeth
There’s going to be ultimate cost savings if I change this air filter now, it’ll cost me less than if I, you know, I don’t even know what I’m talking about. So I’m just making this up, you know, sometimes with things like if you use them to the last minute, it ends up being a big problem or Yeah, cause so the question is it’s, why would I do this?
Elizabeth
Why does this make sense? Why am I customizing this for me? What are the efficiency gains?
Gretchen
And then for Upholders sometimes to keep going, you need to allow yourselves to stop.
Elizabeth
Yeah, that’s one of my secrets of adulthood. And that’s very helpful for Upholders because it’s like if you’re going to keep up that pace that Upholders tend to like, you need to take a break. And this is probably not such an issue for rebels because rebels are sort of like, I need that time. If I need that self maintenance, if I need to take care of something, if I want to, I will.
Elizabeth
And if I don’t want to, I won’t. And then I’ll deal with the consequences. It’s like, okay, so that works too. As long as you accept the consequences.
Gretchen
And gretch, you touched on this, but really it is helpful in terms of health to think about plan maintenance and unplanned maintenance. And we were mentioning this earlier, going to the doctor every year. As much as it’s a pain, it can really help you in many ways.
Elizabeth
And sometimes, you know, it can feel like I don’t want to spend the money or something, but sometimes you spend money to save money. Like do you take care of your teeth regularly or do you wait for some kind of expensive, unplanned dental emergency? It’s kind of the stitch in time saves nine. Yes. And then with exercise, doing the maintenance of exercise ultimately saves you money in terms of so many health consequences.
Elizabeth
So you can think of your exercise routine as your plan maintenance, just like a factory has its planned maintenance. You have your planned maintenance is fun.
Gretchen
Yes. And Gretchen, I will say being someone who has to go to the doctor all the time, I find it helpful to have like a season of going to the doctor, which is kind of like a plan maintenance. Like, Well, in this month, I’m hitting every single doctor.
Elizabeth
Well, you’re treating yourself like a factory, you know, like treat yourself like a toddler. Treat yourself like a teenager.
Gretchen
Okay? Treat yourself like a factory. We have another one coming up.
Elizabeth
There you go. It’s the.
Gretchen
Money. Try this at home.
Elizabeth
Well, then maybe you this when you do your car too.
Gretchen
Yeah. So plan maintenance, make it happen. Yes.
Elizabeth
Yeah. Well, one of the things you might do for your self maintenance, your plan maintenance is to read a book that you enjoy. And Elizabeth, we were inundated with suggestions after our discussion in episode 478 where we had the try this at home suggestion to make life more interesting by reading a book that sheds light on how things work.
Elizabeth
And it’s so funny because I thought that you and I kind of had this idiosyncratic thing where we really enjoyed these books. I didn’t know that this was like a thing. Well, like, so often it turns out that you feel like you’re sort of the only one interested in something or doing something. It turns out, no, this is something that many people share.
Gretchen
Yes. So we will run through some of the suggestions we got. Kathy says, As an engineer, this book spoke to me. The evolution of Useful Things, how everyday artifacts from forks and pins to paperclips and zippers Came to be as they are by Henry Petroski.
Elizabeth
I bought that book to give to Eliza because it sounded like she would love it, Cory said one of my most recommended books ever, and I always feel weird recommending it because it sounds kind of lame, but it is so, so good. It’s called Upstairs at the White House My Life with the First Ladies by JB West. The author was the chief usher at the White House for decades, and it’s so fascinating to read about the different presidents and first ladies.
Elizabeth
He got to know you will love it.
Gretchen
That sounds good, Margaret said. I recently read Maggie Bullock’s book, The Kingdom of Prep The Inside Story of the Rise and Near-fall of J. Crew. The book chronicles the company’s beginnings up to, I believe, the 2020s. It is an easy read and a very interesting look into this iconic brand crash. I was just talking the other day about Jenna Lyons on More Happier.
Gretchen
I think this is what I 100% need to read.
Elizabeth
Yeah. Cindy suggests two books that both found fascinating by Rose George. One is Nine Pints A Journey Through the Money, Medicine and Mysteries of Blood and the Big Necessity The Unmentionable World of Human Waste and Why It Matters. They both sound good.
Gretchen
Kelsey says. I have a great book recommendation for you since you love to learn about how things work. Me too, and have not read the books you mentioned. So adding those to my to be read, I want to share one of my favorites gut the Inside Story of Our Bodies The Most Underrated Organ by Julia Anders.
Elizabeth
Fascinating, Carroll said. I’d like to recommend the song Machine Inside the Hit Factory by John SEABROOK. It tends to take a lot for me to get interested in pop music, and when my daughter was at high school, as I chauffeured her about, she would listen to popular music. This book came up and something about it piqued my interest for a long while After that, I would drive my daughter crazy by pointing out the construction of the songs on the radio.
Gretchen
Marcey says Dog is Love Why and How Your Dog Loves You by Clive Wynne Is one of my newest favorites. And if Chins Could Kill Confessions of a B-movie Actor by Bruce Campbell is an old favorite. I love learning about cutting edge canine genetics and the human dog relationship. And dog is love, and how Bruce Campbell and his hometown friends turned a childhood eight millimeter hobby into careers.
Gretchen
And if Chins could Kill, I love that title. Yeah. There are also podcasts that uncover the design of everyday life as well as my very favorite, which is 99% invisible by Roman Mars. Each episode provides the story of something we all take for granted, or how a design challenge was overcome.
Elizabeth
That’s a great podcast, Stephanie said. One book I recommend to everyone is how buildings learn what happens after they’re built by Stewart Brand. The cover says it all a print of two identical homes side by side from 1850s and a recent photo where they look so different. I have read this book fascinating, Stephanie says.
Gretchen
Here are a few of my favorites. The library book by Susan Orlean, Anything by Mary Roach Bonk Stiff Spook. I know Sarah like stiff.
Elizabeth
I love Mary Roach. I read everything she.
Gretchen
Writes and The Way Things Work by David Macaulay.
Elizabeth
That’s a huge classic. This is another book that I bought for Eliza, and I want to borrow it because it sounds so good. Angela suggests Meet Me by the Fountain and Inside History of the Mall by Alexandra Lange.
Gretchen
Nikki says I’m writing to recommend Paved Paradise How Parking Explains the World by Henry Graybar. It sheds light on how parking policy is created. Not very well, it turns out, and what we’re willing to do to store our cars.
Elizabeth
Interesting, Jackie says the best books that explain how things work are written by Bill Bryson. My favorite of all time is titled At Home A Short History of Private Life. He goes room by room through a house to explain the history and origins of how we live. And then also, many people suggested Bill Bryson’s book, The Body A Guide for Occupants.
Elizabeth
I read both those books. I love Bill Bryson.
Gretchen
These titles are amazing.
Elizabeth
I know, Barb said.
Gretchen
You must read An Immense World How Animal Senses Reveal the Hidden Realms Around US by Ed Yong especially because of your interest in senses.
Elizabeth
I have read An Immense World. It is so good, Suzanne said. You may have already read this one, but Anthony Bourdain wrote the book Kitchen Confidential Adventures in the Culinary Underbelly. This is a behind the scenes read at how a chef runs a restaurant and why you don’t want to order fish on Monday. I haven’t read that. Have you read?
Elizabeth
That was.
Gretchen
I have. And there was also a show based on it. Yes. That that friends of mine worked on. That’s right. Laurie has a podcast recommendation. She said on my morning walk, I listen to a podcast from the U.S. Postal Service called Mail With It. The January 23rd episode chronicles the journey of new stamps. I thought it was fascinating and thought you might enjoy knowing how that works, even though it isn’t a.
Elizabeth
Book love a podcast, Jenna says This book is absolutely fascinating and I believe has very important information for those of us who wear clothes to know Unraveled the Life and Death of a Garment by MAXINE Bennett.
Gretchen
And this comes from Jenny. Here’s another podcast recommendation The Economics of Everyday Things. They are 15 to 20 minute episodes are niche industries like Foley artists or specific items like hotels, soaps, great for quick drives and very interesting insights.
Elizabeth
I really like that podcast. I listen to that. And then finally, Alessandra recommends two books, Hot Box Inside Catering The Food World’s Riskiest Business by Matt Lee. After reading this, I will never go to an event or party and not appreciate the MacGyver type effort it may have taken for me to enjoy a hot ouers d’oeuvre or entree.
Elizabeth
And then the residents inside the private world of the White House by Kate Anderson Brower. A fascinating look at the everyday inside workings of the White House from the people who work there. People are interested in the White House.
Gretchen
Yes. All of these sound great. Gretchen.
Elizabeth
Yes. My to be read list is now dangerously longer than it was before.
Gretchen
Coming up, gretchen gives herself a demerit that is vague but annoying to her. First, this break.
Elizabeth
All right Gretch we are back with demerits and gold stars and this week you are up with a happiness demerit.
Elizabeth
Yes and it is kind of vague, but I’ve been thinking about it like I’ve been very indecisive lately. And I don’t know why. And it’s just kind of making me bonkers. And I don’t know if this is actually a demerit or is it just something I want to pay attention to? Here’s just a silly example. So, you know, I had the podcaster gathering, which was something on my 24 over 24 list, and I printed out the list and then I have the list just sitting out on like a random surface.
Elizabeth
And I keep thinking to myself, What should I do with it? Should I, should I toss it because I have it? My computer? Do I keep it? Is it kind of a memento? Is a useful thing that I feel if I file it, where does it go? What do we do with it? And like, why is this so hard?
Elizabeth
Yeah, it doesn’t really matter. The stakes are so low, and, like, somehow I’m just like, it’s been there for six weeks and just feel like there’s a lot of that. And so I don’t really know what to make of it.
Gretchen
It’s more of a happiness stumbling block, maybe. Yes. Merit.
Elizabeth
Yes, I think that is right. Okay, good. Better classification will help with clarifying my thinking. So stay tuned. I should just flip a coin, right. For something that really doesn’t matter. Flip a coin and do it that way. So maybe I’ll do that.
Gretchen
That’s a good idea. I think you can throw away the list. Might make sense.
Elizabeth
Okay.
Gretchen
Because you have it on your computer.
Elizabeth
I have it on my computer. You’re right. So that one’s done. Now I have, like, 40 others, so I’ll start working those out, but only to have what is our gold star? Take us up.
Gretchen
Well, Gretchen, I mentioned for my plan maintenance. I’m doing my season of doctors right now. Yeah, we have one more doctor that I need to see. Yeah, I just want to give a gold star to all of my doctors who are very attentive. I never feel like they’re rushing me. I really feel like they care. So, Gold star to all those people taking care of me and my type one diabetes.
Elizabeth
yes. Gold Star, all those health care professionals out there, the resources for this week. Well, earlier I mentioned the four tendencies quiz, but I have another quiz. And if you are interested in your five senses, maybe you’re thinking about having a five senses journal and you’re wondering about the question of what is your most neglected sense? You can take my quiz.
Elizabeth
This is a super fun quiz. Just go to happier cast dot com slash quiz and it will tell you your most neglected sense, which for many people is a very interesting thing to learn.
Gretchen
Yeah, great. You and I both have the same most neglected sense, which is taste.
Elizabeth
Yes. And what are we reading, Elizabeth? What are you.
Gretchen
Reading? I am reading the Manor House by Gillie McMillan.
Elizabeth
And I am reading Molly a memoir of a Marriage Cut Short and the Secrets Left Behind by Blake Butler. And that’s it for this episode of Happier. Remember to try this at home. Try to avoid avoidance. Let us know if you avoided avoidance and how you did it and how it worked for you.
Gretchen
Thanks to our executive producer, Chuck Reed and everyone at Odyssey. Get in touch. Gretchen’s on Instagram threads, Facebook and TikTok at Gretchen Rubin and I’m on Instagram and threads at Liz Craft. Our email address is podcast at Gretchen Rubin dot com.
Elizabeth
If you like the show, tell someone you know.
Gretchen
Until next week I’m Elizabeth Craft.
Elizabeth
And I’m Gretchen Rubin. Thanks for joining us. Onward and upward.
Elizabeth
Elizabeth, I love this idea of plan maintenance and sort of a design your year idea. We have the trifecta as part of a design New year. I like this idea of plan maintenance. What do you do for planned maintenance? Sort of. Interesting.
Gretchen
That is a great idea.
Elizabeth
It’s so funny that just giving something a snappy name makes it feel easier to do.
Gretchen
I know. Well, and also, it makes it a whole like world of a thing. Yes. It’s just so massive and we never even thought about it before.
Elizabeth
Indeed, from the onward project.